I hope Hannah doesn’t get bullied.
It’s been a roller coaster year for the CEO of Howard Hanna Real Estate Services. It includes the announcement of the company’s first rebrand in 40 years, several groundbreaking market expansions, and an impressive letter to the National Association of Realtors outlining why the company will not follow Clear Collaboration “as a matter of course.”
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Mr. Hanna’s decision also puts Mr. Hanna in Zillow’s crosshairs, and Mr. Inman’s deep dive into Zillow-Compass court documents revealed that Errol Samuelson and Jeremy Waxman had exchanged text messages about the CEO, saying, “He has finally accepted the difficult news of requiring us to abide by our listing standards.”
Howard “Hobie” Hannah IV
Hanna declined to comment directly on the lawsuit, saying, “I’m not involved and I don’t want to be involved,” but he was adamant that Howard Hanna affiliates and their affiliates will continue to do what is best for the consumers they serve.
“I made it very clear to Zillow that I don’t think they have the right to set standards. I think they were bullying,” he said. “And like I said, sellers should still have a choice. As a company, we’re not trying to hide the ball.”
“But if our agent has a marketing strategy for someone’s home, and that seller doesn’t want to list their home on Zillow, doesn’t want their home on the MLS, and is trying to sell privately and quietly through a brokerage network, that seller shouldn’t be punished. That agent shouldn’t be punished,” he added. “And that’s what I told them. And I know in some of their comments that they think they’re having an impact on another level.”
“They will never influence me.”
Ahead of Inman Connect New York, Mr. Hanna spoke about mergers and acquisitions, consolidation, and what it means for brokers, agents, and consumers.
This conversation has been edited for length and clarity.
Inman: It’s a pleasure to talk to you today. Let’s start with Inman Connect New York. What conversations are you most looking forward to next week? How do you think these conversations will set you up for the year ahead?
Hannah: If you look back 25 years, obviously we ended that year and then we started 26 with a big buzz in the industry with the big acquisition of Compass Anywhere. So I imagine there’s going to be a lot of talk about that. “What do you think about this?” What does it mean for the industry? ”
I think that’s going to be a big conversation. But because of the Rocket and Redfin deals, Cooper and Keller Williams decided to move from private equity to a private equity firm and invest and take a stake.
And, you know, just rumors of other integrations. There will also be broker-to-broker integration, as well as integration between other players in the transaction process, such as mortgages, title, and insurance. I think that is the future that this industry is aiming for.
This is not limited to home buying and selling transactions. It’s about the entire home sales ecosystem and how it connects its customers, their agents, and your company. And I’m sure it will become a hot topic at the National Association.
Let’s start with the Compass and Anywhere merger. In October, you wrote an op-ed for Inman about the challenges of leading a merger. What do you think is the biggest hurdle for Compass? Robert Refkin has said he intends to maintain the independence of all Anywhere brands, but I think there’s still some skepticism about that promise.
It’s difficult to integrate. You need a consistent message. And what’s unique about Robert’s lead is that he grew up with the specificity of the Compass brand. They acquired companies that they determined believed in the Compass model and were willing to integrate into it.
Anywhere includes Anywhere Advisor and its corporate operations. I don’t think we’re going to integrate them. However, 70% of them [Compass] Although it is a brand, it is still largely independent. Just because your brand is on your side doesn’t mean you need to use all the tools and technology.
So how do you build scale? How do you build culture? How do you integrate them? I think that’s one of the challenges they have with running separate brands. How does an agent say, “I work for the same holding company, but I work for Compass, and I compete with Sotheby’s, or I compete with Corcoran?”
So I think there are some challenges when they learn a new field. [real estate] business model. We have to show growth. You have to show scale. For shareholders to bet on your future, you have to show something moving. I think that’s their challenge.
This is consistent with changes that have occurred over the past few years. In the past, shareholders seemed willing to sacrifice profitability if it meant explosive growth. Not so much now. It will be interesting to see.
I agree. I agree. And I think this gives a great opportunity for companies like ours to show that we can stay nimble, stay true to our mission and vision, and attract other companies, agencies, talent and leaders who know we have a clear direction at Howard Hanna. We see a lot of integration happening and think it will work.
Integration…is a word I heard a lot during my time at Inman. But 2025 was the year it happened on a grand scale. What does this mean for agents? What does it mean for consumers? How might groundbreaking deals like the one between Compass and Anywhere change their experience?
First of all, agents still have many options. The franchise network is all there if you choose to become part of a franchise. If you want to be part of an independently owned and operated company, you have that option. There are still many different models available.
But from a broker’s perspective…if you can scale enough and really organize your data, that’s going to be a game-changer over the next three to five years. Many brokerage firms do not handle any of their own data. It’s kind of stagnant. You don’t need to use a simple platform for your agents. AI, trend data, and various forms of marketing will bring about major changes.
We are currently working with a number of partners on how we can strategically distribute data. We’re working strategically on how to distribute data, whether it’s listings to create a more efficient marketplace to sell homes faster for consumers to buyers who have already been approved, who have already considered the market, and are ready to pull the trigger today.
That means faster days on market, more impact, and higher prices.
The same goes for home loans. That’s where I think integration comes into play.
In May, you spoke to Mr. Inman about the letter to NAR and NAR’s decision to cooperate explicitly. I focused on your statement that this is not an issue of private listing or exclusive listing, but rather an issue of industry association overreach.
But since that interview, most conversations about the Chinese Communist Party have been focused on private networks. Do you think people missed the broader plot point? What direction do you hope to take the conversation about CCP in this year?
That’s a great question. I started selling real estate in 1993, and I don’t remember anyone complaining about how the real estate market worked, the MLS, or the efficiency of distribution.
MLS was always designed as a way for brokers to decide when to share inventory and explain that to sellers. No one complained about whether you sold your own products or not. MLS had rules, and being in MLS had rules, but there were no penalties.
…It wasn’t about exclusive products or pocket listings. In some cases, we were able to sell internal transactions faster. That was just part of the process. That was part of the reason I joined the company. They were more listed or had more market share. But there was reciprocity. When you list it on the MLS and know it will sell, you have a chance to sell it as well. [co-brokered] List it the same way they sold yours.
To be honest, everything started to change online and [the Internet Data Exchange]. The first IDX rules were introduced because the idea was that it was unfair for multiple brokers to share data with each other.
The intent was probably good, but it took away the innovation and creativity of some brokers who were ahead of the curve in sharing data with each other, but not with everyone in the MLS. Then, visit portals like Zillow and Realtor.com that pop up along your feed. And the feed to MLS and brokerage companies became revenue for MLS.
And the securities industry has always been B2B-only, so it didn’t get a lot of attention. They were unaware that MLS controlled the data for the listings they acquired. And that was driven by NAR’s introduction of IDX rules and data presentation, MLS rules, and clear cooperation…I think that was overkill.
I think we need to have a dialogue about not participating in NAR and MLS. MLSs, consider what’s best for your local market and membership and defer to your local board of directors. It’s not just about me. That said, don’t handcuff yourself to how someone creatively markets or distributes real estate.
What about discussions about fair housing and discrimination? Is the Chinese Communist Party helping to maintain market transparency and fairness?
Last I checked, the MLS is not a public utility. If they pull it off, everyone has to go there. But I’m not sure if having access to multiple websites to find what you want is a pain for everyone.
And just because everything is on Zillow doesn’t even tell you that Zillow isn’t a public utility. They monetize those listings and sell them back. And now we know they are. [allegedly] Earn rebates on mortgages and other business. You can’t say, “We have these clues, but you need to use our mortgage company.” This is a violation of RESPA. We’ve been subject to that scrutiny, but I don’t think the online portals have been.
So what happens to their market if they don’t have a full list?…I just think the conversation should be, “Let’s be creative in the market.” Let’s innovate. ”
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